5th and Eye receives proposals and NIMBYs surface

While the reverse may not be true, I imagine much of the readership of this blog reads Penn Quarter Living. Yesterday they had a post recapping recent news on the development bids for the 5th and Eye location. You can also find out more details at DCMud.

The PQL post sparked dialogue about the potential retail in each of these proposals. For the purpose of this discussion I’m using retail as a catch all term for restaurants, amenities and retail. On the one hand you have people that selected Mount Vernon Triangle for it’s proximity to Penn Quarter’s retail, the retail that will be at City Vista, and the potential for more retail as the neighborhood continues to be built out. The flip side is the Not in My Back Yard (NIMBY) contingent. They are opposed to anything that could possibly make noise within range of their units and would prefer that retail be instead located “down the street”.

I have a few thoughts on this subject I wanted to share. I will focus my comments with regards to the Boutique Hotel with Jazz club proposal. That seems to be the most polarizing of the proposals that we actually have any details on. I also don’t believe anyone arguing against a basic restaurant or cafe has a foot to stand on – this is downtown city living folks!

Any new venue could lack adequate parking to support it’s customer base and we’d be OK to veto it. Whether it be a Fitness club, Restaurant, Hotel, or Jazz club. Any venue could also implement something that would be genuinely distracting such as the enormous red neon Kenny Rogers Roasters sign in the Seinfeld episode “The Chicken Roaster“. But at this early stage I think the more interesting discussion is on the merits of the individual retail concept than speculating on fine implementation details that we don’t even know yet.

Nearly the entire Triangle is new construction. Presumably our new condos have more sound proofing than if we lived in decades old construction. A new jazz club would also be placed in a venue built for it’s specific use rather than clumsily stuffed into a property not originally designed for music. Moreover, the proposed Jazz Club is described in the DCMud article as a restaurant jazz venue, which is more similar to U Street’s Bohemian Caverns, than a big live entertainment venue like House of Blues.

Given that, I don’t believe noise from the venue is as big an issue for this specific type of club as some suggest. Also I don’t think this sort of venue lends itself to binge drinkers exiting at 2AM and yelling “I’m so drunk right now” while urinating in a tree box. It would be mostly people talking to their friends as they walk to metro or wait for a cab.

Perhaps on the 1st and 2nd floors may get some of this street noise. But you don’t buy a unit downtown on the 1st or 2nd floor if you can’t handle this. People pay premiums to live higher up the building. In this area we aren’t paying that premium for views as nearly every view will be obstructed in the near future by another 130 foot building. We pay the premium for the investment purposes and to be above taxi exhaust and street noise.

The District’s master planing for the Mount Vernon Triangle area designated that 5th street as the “5th Street Retail Corridor”. So retail IS coming. I could learn more about any of these proposals and become concerned but I think at the moment we should continue to be open minded. The community is not going to become more diverse and vibrant if we pass judgment hastily on anything that is different.

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    Anonymous says

    I usually find that decades old construction has much better noise proofing than a lot of the new construction. Why? They used actual plaster instead of dry wall to form thick barrier walls. One of my beefs is sound insulation and I’m happy that my PQ condo neighbors don’t play the stereo loud or make love too often because I can hear it when the soap drops in the bathroom next door. If you’re buying new, ask about the walls, the composition, the interior framing and the insulation used. Some noise is unavoidable in the city but don’t make the assumption that you won’t be able to hear your nieghbors just because you bought a “new” unit.

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    fourthandeye says

    That’s a worthwhile point about drywall vs plaster. Although with regards to this topic I was considering the barrier to the exterior rather than the interior. The windows of today are generally superior in terms of energy efficiency and sound to that of old single pain glass.

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    Anonymous says

    good point on the windows. new windows are typically more sound proof than old windows.

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    fourthandeye says

    According to an article in the post today, the Peebles bid for 5th and Eye calls for a chic hotel, restaurant, coffee shop and a subterranean nightclub.

    Also in the article it mentions that Peebles is in the plans to build the country’s first 6-star hotel in Las Vegas.